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Spin machine: shut down

Not a single of these polls shows Bush as the winner. In fact, according to most of them he got his ass kicked. Even most of the usually delusional members of conservatism are licking their wounds. I even saw one site that had two polls: One of them showed that 98% of the respondents felt that driver's licenses should only be given to people with a valid U.S. ID (a viewpoint that I see as rather conservative). The other showed that Kerry won the debate with something like 80% of the votes.

This is better than I thought. I felt that while Bush was a flustered, angry, arrogant nimrod, Kerry didn't do so well either. He held back from so many great opportunities to just shut Bush down. If I were him, I would have had Bush in tears halfway through. And of course, the only thing consistent about Kerry's answers was that you couldn't figure out what the fuck his position was. This was his golden opportunity to stand and say, "This guy's a fucking idiot. Here's why I'm a better choice." Instead, he stopped just a little after "..idiot.", and that's why swing voters are having a problem committing to him. I can get people to agree with me all day long that Bush is horrible, but it's really hard to make a case for Kerry, because he doesn't really make a great case for himself.

Overall, I still would say Kerry did better, simply because he's a better speaker and debater.

One encouraging poll result I saw was one that showed that 19% of the people surveyed said that the debate changed who they'd be voting for. In that poll, Kerry was ahead with about 78% of the votes.

Comments

( 4 comments — Leave a comment )
shakespearssis
Oct. 1st, 2004 05:30 am (UTC)
bush vs kerry
i am getting only the smallest bit of news coverage here in europe... mostly because we dont have a tv and then what we do see is in a foreign language and we cant keep up.
but i was able to watch CNN these last two days and managed to catch most of the debate. I admit that it sometimes doesnt look too good for Kerry... bush is really spinning the "flip flop" issue a lot, and a voting record is a record, and that's fact. I can imagine a lot of people are seeing that as confusing to say the best.
CNN is saying that bush has an 8% lead in polls currently. but that 16% are waiting for debates to make up their minds. so, cross fingers.
The worst thing i heard from bush (aside from the whiney "i need 30 more seconds" incidents) is that he once refered to "post september 10th". I know it's just a slip, but really... we all know september 11th.
i do know that most of Europe is kind of holding their breath to see who wins. I get the feeling that europeans have had enough of bush, and if he is reelected, relations over here are heading south. I spend a lot of my conversations saying "i didnt vote for bush".

anyway.. enough politics. i took some vespa photos in copenhagen that i bet you'll like. will post them this weekend.
seratonein
Oct. 1st, 2004 08:24 am (UTC)
it would have been wonderful if kerry was forceful enough to drive bush to tears, but that's not realistic :) only those of us who are virulently anti-bush would have appreciated it, anyway. the verbal punches he threw had the right effect.

i think kerry did a fine job of looking presidential & pointing out serious flaws in bush's job performance. this election is a referendum on bush & it was good for kerry to not get bogged down in details of trying to describe his own plans. his mantra of "i can do better" was perfect for this format & for the idiots who are still undecided.
vespa59
Oct. 1st, 2004 09:03 am (UTC)
I disagree with that. Undecideds don't want to hear "I can do better." They want to hear how he can do better. Everyone knows that Bush is a disaster. Kerry doesn't need to burn time reiterating that fact. When he stands up there citing the same Iraq facts over and over and offers nothing but "I can do better," it really makes him sound like he doesn't have a plan. I think he spent a good portion of the debate on the defensive, and when he did have the opportunity to talk about his plans, he instead chose the mudslinging route and didn't really offer up much in the way of a new plan. The only real encouraging behavior I saw in that respect was when he talked about getting the nuclear (and thank goodness he can fucking pronounce the word) materials out of Russia.

That's not to say that I don't have confidence that he could at least start turning things around. I do. But I do a lot more reading and fact seeking than the average moron out there with a voter registration card. These debates are key and in my opinion make or break the whole shootin' match.

Like I said, I think Kerry did well, but I'm hoping to see him do a lot better.
seratonein
Oct. 1st, 2004 09:24 am (UTC)
Everyone knows that Bush is a disaster

unfortunately, they don't. they needed to hear kerry describe the failures out loud & bush defensively respond with "stay the course". as sad as it is, the public needed to be reminded that saddam does not = 9/11.

kerry actually did say "i have a plan" a few times & ticked off the essential points on his fingers. bush has already co-opted some of these ideas, but in a lesser form.

there is no magical plan that will fix iraq & kerry knows this. describing specific details & deadlines would allow bush to go on the offensive. as it is, bush looked lost on what should have been his best night.

it's interesting to get different perspectives on what happened last night. you're the first person i've heard say that kerry was on the defensive. i thought he made a few miscues, but for the most part was forceful and attacked well without appearing bullying or too scholarly. maybe he can do better, but to not only win the debate but also the post-debate spin is damn good for now.
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